There is something deeply disturbing about the superiority and moral authority in the attitude of the country's Child Protection Services to child rearing practices of immigrants; it harks back to darker, less civil and, one would have hoped, long bygone times.
The ongoing case in which the Child Protection Services (CPS) in Stavanger, Norway, have placed two Indian children in a foster home raises important questions about not only the judgment of the representatives of a so-called model state, but also their lack of respect for the possibility that many questions around child care and upbringing may not have definitive answers and therefore a moral basis for passing verdicts about the right and wrong of a wide range of parenting practices.
In a column in the leading Norwegian newspaper, Aftenposten, on February 17, Professor Nina Witoszek at University of Oslo brought to light a similarly distressing case involving two Polish children, Tomasz and Maria, also forcibly taken away from their parents and placed in Norwegian foster homes by the CPS in Stavanger. Prof Witoszek has seen the case papers and compares the behaviour of the CPS with a Politburo policing and enforcing strict parenting norms at the expense of emotional support and empathy. This case also illustrates how, under the powerful mandate of the CPS, malign gossip can suffice to prompt the forcible removal of children from their parents.
Deprived of family network
Turning to the case of Avignan and Aishwarya Bhattacharya and their parents, Anurup and Sagarika, there are too many disturbing claims already in the public domain to remain indifferent. Sagarika Bhattacharya, at the time of the CPS intervention in May 2011, cared for the two children, the boy then aged three and the four-month-old daughter, while Anurup was employed in the oil industry in Stavanger. Both parents were deprived of the family networks that under other circumstances they would have been able to mobilise and draw generous support from. Anyone familiar with and sensitive to the struggles of the Bengali or any diaspora, whether portrayed by Jumpa Lahiri, translated on to the screen by Mira Nair or through other literary, academic or cinematic works, would know that South Asians heading for distant shores leave behind and exchange the often remarkable warmth of their native folks for destinations and locals who may come across as reserved, if not outright hostile.
Stavanger, when compared to the buzz, informality and everyday tamasha of an Indian town, is clean, comparatively cold and remarkably uneventful. And one has to be rather unimaginative or just bereft of human experience to not realise that the transition from the familiar to the new and on this occasion very different, carries with it a genuine risk of trauma. Post-natal depressions are common enough in women: add to this the challenges associated with settling down in an unfamiliar culture, the likely social isolation of in particular the mother and you end up with a potential vulnerability that it is hard not to spot. Into this domestic arena of potential vulnerability, then, march the representatives of the omnipotent CPS.
The Norwegian welfare state is reputed to be working exceptionally well for the average Norwegian, including, admirably, families with strongly disabled children. Maternity and paternity leaves are generous and women's position in Norwegian society is hard to match. These are achievements and exemplary arrangements that Norwegians are rightly proud of and taxpayers are happy (and can afford) to pay for.
There is a catch, however, since for modern nomads like myself, the Norwegian state, whenever it is encountered, is not only harder to negotiate but often founded on logic that it is hard to fathom. And not unlike the behaviour of the CPS in Stavanger, this incarnation of the state can be cold, beastly and more often than not, completely incompetent. Such are the rules and they are not unique. Every year, my retired father has to go to the local police station, document his income during the last 12 months, and write a financial guarantee so that he and my mother will have the opportunity to meet their Indo-Norwegian grandchildren. Indian authorities are decades ahead of their Norwegian counterparts when it comes to making life easier for multi-cultural families like ours.
These are issues that the average Norwegian barely reflects upon and may not even be aware of. Yet, it is against this background, which contrasts with the euphoria surrounding the Norwegian welfare state which is promoted, often with a missionary zeal, that the actions of the Child Protection Services in Stavanger belong and need to be examined.
India, far ahead
As a member of an Indo-Norwegian household that on its way from Norway to India had a 10-year stopover in the U.K., for me there is no question about which of these three states suffers from the greatest disconnect to the modern world. This is not surprising. India with all its imperfections and unresolved challenges also with respect to child welfare is, because of its unique experience and history of nation-building, on the path to becoming a successful multicultural enterprise. Britain's colonial history has had the fortunate side effect of nurturing bonds and cross-cultural understanding that have turned out to be a great asset in an increasingly interconnected world. Yet, even there the murder of the black teenager, Stephen Lawrence, in South London in April 1993 necessitated a reality check — a painful, introspective stop followed by the Macpherson inquiry. The verdict: the recognition that the Metropolitan Police Service was ‘institutionally' racist.
There is something deeply offensive about the idea that the Child Protection Services in a town on the Norwegian west coast, unlikely to possess any knowledge about India at all, perceives itself the best judge of the interests of two small children of Indian parents. By commenting on eating and sleeping arrangements, the number of toys, whether the parents may have had an argument (and, yes, melodrama is a facet of Indian family life), the CPS has entered a territory where the prospects for reasoning are endless but the hope of arriving at normatively anchored conclusions, as some of my colleagues would put it, is converging on zero. Even more disturbing is the impression of the sense of superiority and parochial moral authority that permeates the handling of this case, echoing attitudes associated with darker, less civil and, one would have hoped, long bygone times.
Two families with small children arrive at Norway's shores with aspirations, I imagine, of a better life. And how does one of the richest countries in the world treat them? It is hard to think of anything quite as despicable as the humiliation and de facto annihilation of two potentially vulnerable families we are witnessing here. Take a moment to reflect upon what the representatives of our state, the CPS and the courts have done to not only the Bhattacharyas and the Polish family but also our image of ourselves as citizens of a dignified, fair and generous society.
As in the landmark Stephen Lawrence case, there are enough hints of ugly undercurrents to suggest the need for a thorough reality check: an independent inquiry into the mandate and practices of the CPS (say, by Human Rights Watch), a recognition of the need for intense monitoring and scrutiny of the CPS including how cultural diversity in parenting practices and family support systems is respected and handled, the role of the police, the composition of the courts (note that in both these cases, the lower courts threw out the case suggesting there was nothing to answer) and so forth. There is, at the same time, a larger question of how Norway comes to terms with and catches up on developing public institutions that cater not only for pucca Norwegians but have in-built checks and balances that allow for a better handling of multiculturalism and can help to prevent tragedies like these.
(Vegard Iversen is Norwegian, and is a visiting scholar at Institute of Economic Growth, Delhi University)
Keywords: Norwegian laws, Indian culture, child protection laws, child care, India-Norway ties, parenting norms
What is the success rate of CPS?
How many cases has it "saved" and the children gone to become Einsteins or
Pavarottis' ?
How many children have complained against CPS?
How many cases has the CPS lost?
These are the arguments which the parents should use to fight the CPS.
By portraying the CPS as less than capable and more error prone, the parents need
to sow the seeds of doubt in court's mind about the judgements of CPS.
This will ensure the CPS is on the defensive side rather than portraying itself as a
righteous character fighting neanderthal parents: as it is thinking today.
Expecting pity or sympathy from CPS is like expecting snowfall in Summer in south
india. Will not happen. Instead, taking the fight to CPS and portraying them as bad,
will make the judge think twice before acting on a complaint.
It is much ado about nothing. Different cultures follow different child
rearing practices. Do in Rome as the Romans do. The way the state in
Norway treats children (or for that matter kitchen helpers) is different
from that in India. We should not start crying foul even when there is
no shred of prejudice or discrimination.
I like this article. The author is very sensitive and candid about
this issue and open to discuss about his own "Motherland" critically. I wish, as the author suggests, there comes an Independent
Investigation by Human Right Watch to get into the details of this
particular case and in general the lack of or the need for proper
training for the CPS, Police and the Courts as far as multi-
culturalism is concerned in Norway, the so-called very successful
Welfare State in the world. Perhaps, the Indian Govt must ask for one Investigation by the Human Rights Watch. Wait & watch.
Excellent article, and very sensitive too. Indeed, it is deeply offensive for an institution in Stavanger, which is unlikely to have any exposure to Indian culture and parenting practices, should arrogate to themselves that they know what is best for the children than the parents. Owing to strict confidentiality laws, all that the CPS has said that they found an "emotional disconnect" between the mother and the children. In case of extreme physical abuse or neglect that endangers the lives of the children, separating them from the parents is justified. However, the CPS never used the phrase "physical abuse" or anything that endangers the lives of the children. Even the widest definition of "emotional disconnect" is unlikely to include anything close to that. "Emotional disconnect" can only lead to a less than best possible growth of a child. However, the best possible growth of a child always remains in realm of possibility. How on earth foster care is better for the kids in this case?
While the Norway government is concerned with Telenor Company’s investment after 2G license cancellation in India, it is barely recognize the inalienable right of the parents. (Norway steps in to rescue Telenor -www.thehindu.com/news/national/article2868721.ece
). The business concern shows it gives more priority to investment than to life. Especially when the lives of immigrants whose social background is very different, the government could have been more empathetic, instead applying rules uniformly. Basically, Stringent Child protection system could be good for the society where single parents and step parents are common and where there is chance for neglecting children. Anyhow the incident is eye-opener for immigrants to repatriate to home country or atleast leave for countries, having better living rules.
I am living in Norway for past 5 years or so so when the case came up I was doubting about if the parents were telling the whole truth, but now when the details are getting published I am simply not able to digest the happenings. This is horrific and should not happen to any parents in the world. If possible we should raise the case in International court for Human rights violations on the department. The Normal Norwegian people are very friendly and helping nature but when it comes to well funded gov.t departments it could be the case hence lets not blame the whole country but the Child welfare department in this particular city....
Hi everyone I had a chance to work with a young man from Norway In
Sydney ,a typical case of cultural ignorance ,hyper critical of Indian
arrange marriage ,Suddenly I find him quite depressed due to his 6 years
Swedish girl friend ,dumping him for further Australian visa for
herself ,Then I explain him that the difference she left you man only
for Australia ,if it was us no way ???????, so you can judge the attitude
of its comman citizen ,then the state
It's most unfortunate that Norway has deprived the 4-month old baby of her mother's milk. How on Earth can anyone support this idea of foster care? It smacks of perceived cultural superiority and clearly this draconian law shows that Norway is culturally underdeveloped.
My prayers are with the parents who are mentally subjected to the torture of being separated from their children.
If the parents want their children to be Norway, then the rules of the country applies. When parents/grand parents want to take back their children out of Norway then those rules do not apply. Norwegian government should return the children safely at the same speed with which they took their custody.
@Trilok Singh, It's a useless point about saving money on child toys. A
child does not need many toys he needs your time. That's it. It is upto
you how many toys you want to buy. There is no logic behind this. The
whole concept of learning through toys is useless. I see my both kids
play with toys not more than 10-15 mins. There is no point giving them
new toy.
Excellent article. The news when it first appered stuck me like an Orwell super-state happening! A lesson for all Indians who try merely to imitate the westerners in almost everything and blindly believe that 'secular' or 'multi cultural' means living in Europe or the Americas.
I hope the Indian government and the media hold forte and unite the cildren and parents. This would be necessary to open Norways eyes as well.
It is really sad from the perspective of the parents that the children are seperated from them. May be the CPS has a legitimate (as per norway law) point in keeping them in foster home. If the parents want to stay in norway, they have to follow the rule of the land. But if the parents want to return to India, how can Norway keep their child in that land? or is it like a punishment to the parents, (because they violated the standards set by CPS), their children will be seperated till they are 18? In that case, it is really a brutal and uncivilised view point.
Though India's record in child protection is quite bad, in this context, it is not (and should not be) a matter of concern to anybody.
Thank you for Vegard Iversen opinion piece. This
article gives viewpoints of a person who has experienced cultures in
three parts of the world.
Our elders used to frown upon crossing the high seas (taboo), today
this might be called superstition. One person's superstition is
another person's faith. Today's economic migrants are ready to forsake
the land of their ancestors, with resultant culture shocks. Is it
right to have your cake and eat it too? Can it be minimized by
undergoing training before travelling?
The episode raises a few questions: Do the foster parents to whom
custody has been provided, have child/ren of their own? Do they derive
special monetary/other benefits from the state agencies for services
performed? I suppose the answers to these may be a pointer to the over
enthusiasm by the so called regulatory authorities in abducting!! the
children under the garb of regulation and giving the children to
childless couples unable to have offspring of their own.
Rich as Norway may be, it has made a wrong call on this one. Money doesn't buy you morality. Reminds me of Richie Rich - "Poor little Rich boy"!
@Fred Pickens: And why do you think that has happened? Could it be, perhaps, that the CPR thinks it's not beholden to answer all the points raised here? I'd like to have an open mind here - I don't have an insight into their reasoning - but given that they went above and beyond the initial court ruling indicates to me that they're being vindictive.
"Welfare State" - there is where the problem lies. “Sameness” is an essential property of the Welfare State.
I just amazed as to why people don’t get the fact that in a welfare state you are bound to be treated like this. Its not possible to cherry pick the benefits of welfare state. Like in any other system the benefits come will associated ills.
If the authorities decides to play a parental role for its citizen it has to ensure a system where every one equal. It will achieve this even at the cost of eliminating all cultural diversity.
This is not because the authorities are incompetent. It’s just that there is no other way to provide welfare to the extent Norway provides to its citizen.
It's not possible to centrally control a system that is diverse and different.
If you think that the other man's grass is always greener behave as the native cows do. Cultural relatavism and multi-culturism are just words! For another remeber the White Man's burden has not eased all these years.
The irony is, these are the people who fight for the animal rights!!
I have the story of my own son from the UK, having been taken away by the system, looked after well by the 'White' men as you may want to call, totally destroyed by a Bengali Doctor and his team, leading to lies to cover up the destruction. I hope 'The Hindu' will publish this issue of significance that I can substantiate with pictorial, documentary evidences. It has happened in the UK and I have been running from posts to pillar asking from the Prime Minister of the country to 'restore my son to original setting'. Any system that does not recognize the intricacies of the individual culture, culinary tastes, family ties, is based purely on 'economics' and will destroy the humanity. It is not to say that the general 'Indian Culture' is far superior to 'any other culture'. Some faimilies, some individuals, live for values that far beyond the modern economic parameters. Imagine Norway and Uk without NorthSea oil!!
A child belongs with his/her parent unless physical harm is involved. The spurious
reason given by the norwegian child protective agency to take the child from the
parent is cause enough for India to file a human rights complain to the European
Human rights council. Perhaps India can exercise its child protective rights by taking
away the norwegian consulates child as they do not follow indian customs in india.
Two can play this game, but the victim here is the child whose natural rights to bond
with his/her parents have been denied. Someone should sue the judge and the
department concerned.
The children are the unfortunate victims of this pretty sad
developments in Norway. The Child Welfare services may be doing a
great disservice to the emotional bonding of the two children and
Indian parents. Nobody understands the needs of children better than
parents. It is a simple truth that these social services should
understand and come to terms with the cultural differences in child
rearing in India and abroad. Their intentions may be genuine. We would
never know the actual circumstances that led to these problems. The
Indian parents may have contributed to this fiasco. They must put
aside their differences, ego and focus single-handedly in solving this
mess and hand over the children to parents/uncle immediately. I
think this gives Norway an opportunity to re-examine the policies
leading to these unfortunate developments and take a fresh look at the
cases of other unfortunate children/parents in similar situations.
we slept in our parents beds and our children in ours when we/tey were tiny tots. It is the way in India. We live lin USA and we didnt change either. We still feed kids with hands during their early years. Norway MUST EXPLICITLY and repeatedly INFORM indians about their law (sic) as and when they see a child entering a family or country. These 2 parents are following their hindu way of raising kids, what do they know about the high incidence of child abuse ongoing in Norway? Some lands have these knee jerk reactions and reactionary responces once they see this so called abuse. The international court and Delhi govt must restore the family claims and bring the kids under parental care pronto. This an act of harassment and racism.
I found this article very poorly written. What is the problem it has
sought to highlight. And I found a fear in the author to express things
straightforwardly.
This is a very sad situation. We should be looking at this 20 years ahead. Has anyone looked at the statistics of children raised in foster care and what their adulthood is like? So often we talk about the 'best interest of the child' and forget about the 'best interest of the individual'. When these innocent kids grow up into good mature adults, they will still have scars from this one way or the other. And it is a fact, that we live majority of our life as adults and not just as children. So we should be keeping both interests in mind - the best interest of the child today and the adult of tomorrow to make them a productive member of our society. Is this what the Norwegians have in mind?
Based on what I have heard from the parents in the media - they are definitely concerned about the kids both about today and for tomorrow. Their heart is in the right place. Our prayers are with them.
Mr Iyer; the total population of people of Indian origin (PIO)and non-resident Indians (NRI) in west Europe combined is around 1.7 million, and in the whole of the Americas around 5 million. Assuming 40% of Indians are youths would mean 2.6 million youths are present in the west, which is, 0.65% of all the Indian youths. How would you call that "bee-lining"? Secondly, you are using the flawed logic that everything should be "perfect" first: a logic commonly propounded by western governments and media to criticize any development activities being taken in the third world. They preach moral lessons on how we should not undertake anything else that eliminating poverty; read some of the articles by Sara Sidner in CNN and you will understand this.
The Indian parents, in the european countries, save on the toys, shoes,clothes of
the children but cash Child support offered by he Government. This saved money
is then sent to India or kept apart to be spent on the lavish ceremonies during
Indian caste arranged(some times forced) marriages.The foster states have to take
care of the future citizens as the children born there are automatically citizens of
the european countries.
How does Indian state care about its own children and the children of the
refugees(Tibetens,Hindu and Sikhs from Afghanistan,Bangladeshis,Tamils from Sri
Lanka etc....?)
@SSKI continued
Modern nomads continue to hold allegiance to their homeland. They contribute to their homeland not only by the way of remittances but also by establishing an informal link between people in their homeland and the world outside. They are informal ambassadors of their country. Your suggestion: “..should be willing to follow rules and traditions…”, falls on two accounts. 1. It assumes that ALL rules and traditions are worthy of emulation. And 2. It undermines the ability of your countrymen to not only be followers but also leaders. Probably you only had a segment of Indian diaspora in your mind when you passed your judgment – the segment that does not actively engage in society building processes, and I sense a certain sense of distancing in your tone. I hope you would revise your opinion and accept all your countrymen whether RIs or NRIs equally.
---
@SSKI
Indeed any jurisdiction can have any law whatsoever its stakeholders demand on any matter (e.g. what is stopping India to enact a law that: all foreigner children should learn at least 1 Indian language, you can imagine how far this can be stretched) but if one of the purposes of law is natural fairness then the level of governance a State seeks over the people on its soil should be balanced with a) the level of privileges that they enjoy, b) the initial covenants (explicit or implied) of the initial contract under which the person is present on the foreign soil. May be what Norway has done is excellent law enforcement but poor poor jurisprudence.
continued ...
@SSKI: Yes, the moot question is not about morality. Some people go to 'settle' and some other people go because their employer 'needs' them in that location and the host country grants them a temporary work visa to carry out their duties because 'their economy' would benefit. The key features of the initial residence contract (visa) are: fixed term residence, tax payment situation from day 1, low flexibility in choice of employer, and no participation in host country's democratic processes. The relationship is primarily pecuniary in nature. Contrast this with a Citizen's position. It is understandable that some of the laws would (should be) be applicable on these immigrant workers (e.g. all criminal laws) but given that they do not enjoy all the privileges that Citizens enjoy the governance over such immigrants on personal matters should be minimal.
At a personal level, my heart goes out to the Indian couple stuck in Norway with their children separated from them. I do hope the issues get resolved and they get reunited soon. However, I find the stance taken by many of the readers here hypocritical. It is a shame that Indians go around the world trying to settle in these countries. If one is doing that, one should also be willing to follow the rules and traditions of that country - and accept whatever consequence it brings. I am amazed by the moral superiority in many of the reader's comments. If India and Indian customs were so superior, why is it that so many of our most privileged youth (most with good education subsidised by tax payers) make a bee line for these 'uncivilised' countries?
Recently, there was a news item of a couple putting up their girl child for sale in India. What are these 'morally superior' readers doing to keep the child and parents together? Put your house in order first before judging others.
Where is the evidence that the Norwegian Authorities are acting
in anything other than the best interests of the children? Does
the Norwegian Child Services have a history and a track record of
discriminatory and racist practices against immigrants? I am
afraid that the article does not provide any insights about these
key questions, without which I am unable to make up my mind one
way or another.
There are a lot of commenters speaking in terms of cultural
relativism. It is indeed true that different cultures have
varying attitudes to child rearing and family values. But a state
has to have policies based on what it holds as child rights and
cannot accommodate the whims of immigrants. Sure, they must be
patient and considerate to differences and must explain the state
policy to the parents. In this particular case, it has been
reported that the authorities have been in touch with the parents
for many months before they took the drastic step.
This is utterly cruel on the part of Norwegian Child Protection Services. Are they teaching us how to upbring our children? Do they know ABCD of child care? If yes, then why many of their children desert their parents when they attain 17-18 years of age? Since childhood they have not been taught about affection, brotherhood, concept of joint family. Entire world know about culture of India and also the culture of other European countries. They are not the right people to teach us about child care. Our government is not strong enough. It is not enough that our External Affairs minister visited Norway and discussed the issue with them. Till end-result is achieved, the issue should be persistently followed-up. Diplomatic pressure is to be put on Norway. If this has happened to a foreigner in India particularly from US or other rich european countries, by this time the issue would have been resolved and our government would have yielded to the pressure. It is a pity that we are not strong enough to confront and pile up pressure on Norwegian authorities.
Reading above comments, I think that there are both sides of the
story: Norwegian side 1. They have rules. If you go to some country, you have to follow their rules. 2. They have to enforce their laws and orders. They have seen their children growing perfectly in the environment and hence, the laws were made. If you can't provide those facilities, you are sub-standardising the well being given to the child(in material terms). 3. There is no way to judge non-material care given, so they have set criteria on material terms.
Indian Side: 1. Let parents decide how to bring up their children. 2. We(Indians and parents) give more care than anyone on this earth(really true)
Solution: 1. Let parents explain their point of view. 2. Provide them toys and material things(everything that is missing as per you), than taking child away(hence, their happiness and life). 3. Start respecting outside cultures a bit more than today.
What has never been reported in the media is whether the Norwegian authorities took any efforts to support the parents and give them services such as counseling, parenting class, etc. that would have enabled them to relate better with their children, and reunite with the children. The details of what the parents supposedly did to the children have been cloaked so far (other than issues such as hand feeding, co-sleeping, and insufficient toys). But whatever they supposedly did, why is the solution according to Norway to permanently split up this family and tear the children away from their parents and culture? Why not be very open about what steps are being taken to help the parents do better and regain their children? Why is reunification with parents out of the question? Is this inhumane approach the best that the great Norwegian state and welfare authorities and armies of social workers can do?
one thing is very clear: the western countries have no respect for
multi-cultures and multi-ethnicity; there is strong under current in
favor of unilateralism. Parenting, care and love is not all about
feeding and method of sleeping; it is much more - these non-sense
Norway (No-right-way) people never understand this.
Norwegian higher authorities have decided that the two Indian children have to be returned to the children's uncle. This should be done sooner than later. What happens afterwards should not be the concern of CPS, Norway. Will it possible for them to enforce their laws in India? There are millions of children, outside Norway, who may or may not be looked after properly. CPS, Norway should realize that they are not the guardian of all children worldwide.
Rightly pointed by Mr Iversen, the CPS needs to understand the cultural diversity. Theworld is much more closer, different cultures exist in the same region. The CPS should not be indifferent to the parents and the children, infact the decision was very robotic and now it seems I am wasting my energy and time. I hope the CPS goes through all these comments which show how the people are feeling. We are not the parents of the children taken away, hard to imagine their pain.
I do not know if the family or the CPS are in the wrong here (or none or both), but
what is striking is the unreserved acceptance of the families story as fact. I'm not
saying they are lying, but the CPS is bound by confidentiality and never comment on
these cases. It should at least be noted that everything written about the causes of
the decision are unsubstantiated claims from one party.
That eating with hands, sleeping in a shared bed or the right toys would worry the
CPS is extremely unlikely. Also their citizenship is utterly irrelevant; one follows the
laws where one lives, and the CPS is responsible for all kids on their soil, wherever
they come from.
This might be a terrible error from the CPS, but we have no way of knowing that.
We've heard only one side of the story. The Indian media coverage on this has been
extremely one sided, full of glaring errors and is not grounds to pass judgement on.
For example, "experts" interviewed are extreme anti-CPS activist.
Simply it is unthinkable how any one can separate a three month and
five year children from their parents. I think only barbarians can do
this. The western countries make so much noise about human rights, children rights. Do they consider this doesn't affect childrens' rights or human rights. how a child separated from parents at such tender ages and kept with foster parents until they are 18 years of age, can acquire their mother tongue, culture and traditions of their parents and forefathers. They will grow up without the traditions , love of parents, mother country, which make a person what he is. No country has a right to deny any person to grow up in the traditions of their parents. I do not know how the Norwegians do not understand this. They appear to be just like the frogs in a well. Hope better sense will prevail over them.
As a formal protest to this seemingly racist move by Norway the parents of these children should abandon this country along with thier children. It is not worth making a living in a country that does not respect our core values.
Its strange that you oppose Norway's decision, considering that India has a child sex abuse rate that is the highest in the world, after Muslim and African countries.In a shocking revelation, a government commissioned survey has found that more than 53% of children in India are subjected to sexual abuse, but most don't report the assaults to anyone. The survey, released on Monday and which covered different forms of child abuse physical, sexual and emotional as well as female child neglect, found that two out of every three children have been physically abused.However, a private survey found the numbers to be over 80%. In WHO data by Indian family members; 76% women across five cities in India admitted sexual abuse as children. How then can you be surprised? Indian immigrants have one of the highest sex and crime records in foreign countries, in prevalence to percentage of population. If they want to take precaution for this child, they have investigated before taking action.
That the Norwegian Courts have dismissed the cases shows there is not even a shread of evidence against the parents. And when such is the case, weaning the children away from their parents is an infinitely greater crime than what the CPS is accusing the parents of. Norway must realize that they are on the wrong side of world civilization in this respect and back off. They are Indian citizens, and must be returned to their parents (and India). Indian government should not at all backoff and keep increasing the pressure if Norway refuses to see reason. CPS seems like some mafia to keep paying gangs of "foster parents" who are trained to measure food in test tubes and feed by the clock, can they ever give a child the warmth and love that a parent does? Never!!
Thanks for your piece Mr. Iversen.
One question: why aren't you writing about this issue in the Norwegian media?
Surely, would words carry a lot more weight there, and, hopefully, make an
actual difference.
Norwegians need more exposure to other cultures around the world, being a developed country economically does not mean you are culturally developed.
I have lost any respect I had for Norway or Norwegians. Not that my view matters. But, by expressing it, I am making known what I and many alike feel about Norway. But, for this incident, we would have held high opinion of Norway, as a model state. But, following the case of these two innocent children, and racial tones that this case has projected, has portrayed the dark side of Norway. How in the world can a civilized society take away two children aged 3 years and 1 year from its own mother. And as the case highlights, these are normal occurences in Norway is shocking. We sincerely pray that this saga has a happy ending, where the children are brought back to India, and will be in the safe custody of the chidlren's family.
It is very surprising that no authority like Chief of Women's Commission or Chief of Child's right commission, or any MP make it a point to go to Oslo, Norway and express concerns and hand over a strong worded letter. The issue came only in light when the grand parents of those 2 poor children met with President and its really very painful that Honorable President of India got to intervene.
See the latest case of Italian Sailors killing of 2 fishermen, the Dy Foreign minister of Italy came down within a week and met with his counterpart and then did not stopped there and met with the CM of Kerala.
See the case of supreme court cancelling all 2G mobile licenses. The trade minister from Norway Fly down to delhi same week to save interest of Telenor.
Why not any one of Dy minister in Women's Dept or Health Dept, or from HRD ministry immediately go to Norway and register strong protest.
'India ...is, because of its unique experience and history of
nation-building, on the path to becoming a successful multicultural
enterprise'. Mr. Iversen, thank you for being generous in your
assessment. But the truth is to brutal and opposite to be diluted by
your generosity. India is not a successful multicultural state. As
an Indian, I am ashamed to admit that we are still a people who
believe in might is right. We are racist, intolerant of differences,
little respect for cultural differences and practices and very
comfortable living in cultural ghettos - even in so called modern
cities like Mumbai, Delhi or Bangalore.
At this point, the legal documents are pretty much out in the open. Their key points
have been published in the Indian press. And it's clear that the reasons of the
Norwegian CPS, if you can call them reasons, are the flimsiest imaginable, based on cultural ignorance, gossip, innuendo and, yes, a dose of racism. The worst part is that the CPS won't admit its error and thereby have the court order revoked. It's trying to save face now, while continuing to subject the family to excruciating pain and humiliation. ... It's not an experience that India should forget and forgive any time soon.
The State of Norway must introspect and realize "what is a perfect family", with divorce rates close to half the population (43% see divorce statistics of Norway) and a large population living in "non-commital" live-in relationships, it is strange for them to impose upon others their cultural morality as superior child upbringing practices.
Diverse rates in India are extremely low and even if partners in Indian marriage are not satisfied with each other, they continue to live solely because of their commitment to child's future. They risk not to offend or shock their kids and make them devoid of the love of both Mother and Father. Most of them continue to guide the children well throughout their life and live with them. It is strange for the Norwegians to lecture us on love. Sure we have our own failures but our failures are mostly in the state domain but not on the societal or familial relationships.Ours may be a weak state but has always been strong society which theymay not realize
"Indian authorities are decades ahead of their Norwegian counterparts when it comes to making life easier for multi-cultural families like ours." I suppose you are white. Had you been black, you would have seen a very different picture of India. We are deeply racist: We think whites, like you, are good and will do the right thing, and blacks, especially those darker than us, are evil or stupid. As an Indian, I am ashamed of this.
@Krishna Kanth: What makes you think that Norway in 'Normal'? 'Best interest of the children' is a well intended (but much abused) prologue to a whole set of child welfare related instrumental laws. But how the prologue finds its manifestation in text of the law, context of the cases can be sometimes as subjective as answer to the question: what is good food? Leave aside Norway even Normal countries can err while brimming with the best intentions. Good law and good enforcement starts with good jurisprudence, something that does not come Normally with the tides, especially if you are in one corner of the World.
Vegard’s article demonstrates that development comes in segments and ‘Norway needs more’. Being a modern nomad myself, if we let things take their natural course while ‘developing countries’ (like Norway) come to grips with their issues, a lot of avoidable damage would occur. Granting good intentions to the CPS in Norway, there are structural issues in the way issue is approached that fosters a nexus among the ‘CPS industry’ players. The international order today does not appear conducive for international skilled labour mobility. Norway insists that, while on Norwegian soil, Norwegian law is supreme. Good enough, if someone comes to my house, temporarily, they should follow my rules around the house. What should I do if they break some rules? Create repercussions that keep them within the house for their life? Or just ask them to leave? What covenants should govern international skilled labour mobility? We can’t hold the whole world hostage while Norway wakes up. Some work for ILO?
Mr Iversen is obviously familiar with both cultures having been born into one and living in another. His observations that the Norwegian authorities have not taken cultural differences in upbringing into account in this case is very true. As an Indian mother I cannot imagine anything more cold, barbaric and draconian than taking away a child who is still being breast >fed (Aishwarya was 4 months old) and putting them away in foster care over such flimsy reasons.This is truly is the most bizarre action by authorities of the " worlds richest nation".Is it only wealth and money that go into making one rich?I beg to differ,a history, culture, traditions, language, art these are the things that build a nations character and richness.The parents may not have given them the toys according to the standards of Norway but I am sure they imparted more warmth, love and affection than an average Norwegian parent. Shame on the Norwegian authorities and their unreasonable laws. Hope good sense prevails
the bond between parents and their children is a universal fact. It is something we find in plants and animals too. you don't have to study world culture to appreciate this. what disturbs me is the total disregard of the emotional well being of the toddlers in question. just imagine the scars these kids will have to live with for the rest of their lives. i am not even trying to imagine the trama of these parents. just because someone who visited the family did not understand the indian way chose to take matters in his/hands. instead of choosing a more humane way they chose to go by the book. i am not questioning the child protection plan. my only suggestion is how about including the parents in the protection plan. surely any parent would appreciate the society's effort to safe guard the interest of their child.were the parents even given a fair chance to explain their of way nurturing their babies.
I completely agree with the author that the situation has risen due to poor understanding of our culture by the concerned authorities and may I add, due to the ignorance of the parents themselves with respect to regulations in Norway. I remember once when we were in Germany in a small town (which had not seen Indians) during one winter an old lady chided a friend of ours in public for improperly protecting their kid while on a stroll. Actually she was concerned but it appeared as though she was behaving with a parochial moral authority towards my friend !. Usually MNCs conduct inter-cultural workshops to their employees and provide them with guidelines etc when they are deputed. Maybe it is time CPS also conducts such things in future so that their officers can educate the local population when they complain to them of something "fishy" going on with their neighbour !
Norway is out of line to require the grandparents to visit Norway and report their income at a police station to make sure the grandparents can afford to visit the child every year. This is not child protection but clear discrimination against foreigners settling down in Norway. The Child Protection Agency of Norway is a tool to implenment this draconian rule discriminating or discouraging foreigners settling in Norway. It is doubtful that the EEC will recognize this Norwegian rule. Foreigners are not allowed to settle down in most Middle East countries with rules and regulations that are not acceptable in most countries. If anybody land in the US, that person can claim asylum without a passport or visa. Any illegal migrant in US, the state is expected to offer all previlages to the children of illegal migrant, including food, education and medical care even without any insurance. The result is the US ended up with 12-15 million illegal migrants, draining the economy.
Mr.Iversen, Your article while illuminating the problems of state control on things such as parenting and providing for the children of the household does not seem to take into consideration the "acceptable standards" that are held in such situations. As long as the normal run of the mill Norwegian is expected to adhere to these so called "standards", I see no problem in enforcing them across the entire population of Norway. You see, ignorance of the cultural and societal mores is NOT an excuse for not complying. I don't think any "normal" nation will have draconian laws that makes it a felony in case of non-compliance the first time around - there is bound to be some lawful redress which if not followed results in such isolation/separation. I may be mistaken since I'm not quite in touch with this case as you may be, but I think it is morally legal with no sense of superiority or parochial attitude being displayed, whatsoever - what goes for the Norwegian goose for the Norwegian gander!
I am deeply disturb by these events. The very idea that anyone else
can take my children and on top of it hand them over to foster parents
is unthinkable. The whole episode seems to be quite normal for Norway.
And this a country which dolls out Peace awards, Nobel. What's noble
in this? This is nothing but abducting and may I say this is criminal
in nature. Anyway no wonder we are animals even though we can call
ourself humans. I am glad that this "News" has not died down. The
Hindu should pursue this case till children are handed over to
parents. Nothing else. Nor-wain authorities should be ashamed of themselves. How is this different from Australians taking over
children from aborigines? May be after many many suffering of great
many innocents, robbing them of their culture, natural parents and
natural love will Norway change.
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