Afghanistan has always kept India in the loop on the talks with the Taliban, says Afghanistan Chief executive Abdullah Abdullah. In an interview to Diplomatic Editor Suhasini Haidar during his visit to Delhi, he speaks about the upcoming next round of talks in Islamabad, and on the possible links between attacks in Pathankot and Mazar I Sharif.
You are in India just a month after PM Modi visited Kabul, there has been a flurry of meetings recently. What kind of impact will these meetings have on the India-Afghanistan Strategic partnership, particularly given the SPA commission hasn’t met in four years?
Dr. Abdullah: The visit of PM Modi to Kabul re-energised strategic relations. The SPA commission will meet in the near future, and the strategic dialogue will happen. The nature of the visit, the inauguration of the parliament that was built by India was an important symbol of our friendship.
Was there a strain between New Delhi and Kabul over the Taliban reconciliation process?
Dr. Abdullah: I think perhaps we had different priorities that we were looking at but in terms of fundamentals of the relationship, I don’t think there was a problem. On how to prioritise, we may have had issues, but it’s a natural relationship, which has a strong foundation, and now the Strategic partnership will bring our history together with our future initiatives.
One of the more prominent initiatives is the transfer of 4 Mi35 helicopters by India to Afghanistan. How significant is that, and how are the helicopters being used?
Dr. Abdullah: The helicopters were an important initiative, not just a symbolic gesture. It has had an impact already on the morale of the forces as well as the combat operations they are being used in.
Was there also a negative impact? Within days of the transfer being announced during the PM’s visit, both the Pathankot airbase where the Mi-35s were flown out from, and at the Indian mission in Mazar I Sharif. Could those attacks be linked with India’s decision to transfer the helicopters?
Dr. Abdullah: There have been attacks on Indian interests in Afghanistan before. So I wouldn’t make that judgement at this stage, but what I can mention is that our security forces dealt with the attack in Mazar very courageously and that has been appreciated by the Indian government. Of course it is best to prevent those incidents from happening.
So you’re not ruling out a link? I ask because we saw some similar messaging in both: a note from the attackers in Pathankot mentioned Jaish e Mohammad and Afzal Guru, and graffiti on the wall in Mazar had Afzal Gurus name…
Dr. Abdullah: Yes, all of this evidence is available, but I cannot make that judgement, because there are two levels to this. One is that these terrorist groups and their aims and goals are known. The other details of the attacks and any linkages must be discussed by the countries directly not in the media.
In your speech at the Counter Terrorism conference in Jaipur this week you proposed a regional counter terror action force…is that realistic, given the level of mistrust in the region?
Dr. Abdullah: It is a necessity and a realistic lesson from our experiences of the past two decades. Think about it, if you can visualise the impact of such a cooperation, how positive it will be. It is a necessity.
This weekend the Quadrilateral coordination group (QCG) will meet again to try and find a way on talks with the Taliban. Are you hopeful of an immediate outcome and a restart of direct talks with the Taliban?
Dr. Abdullah: We hope that these talks with lead to the resumption of the Taliban talks. This group has met several times in the past and this is the 4th QCG meeting where they talk about a roadmap. Once the talks start, it will be Afghan owned and Afghan led. But this is the group that facilitates the talks.
What do you hope for? When we saw the last round of the talks in Murree in Pakistan, there was a message from Mullah Omar welcoming them. Then it turned out Mullah Omar had been dead all along….
Dr. Abdullah: That shows the complexity of the situation.
Many would call it a sham…
Dr. Abdullah: Oh absolutely it was (a sham). But we have a problem at hand, and it doesn’t matter if we are disappointed or hopeful, we have to make the right efforts.
In doing so, your government has crossed several red-lines, among them that the Taliban would have to give up violence, it hasn’t. Or that it would have to accept the Afghan constitution and it hasn’t
Dr. Abdullah: Those were not pre-conditions for the talks. We were talking about the outcome. If the outcome anyway violates our constitution that is an absolute redline. If the groups want to continue links with terrorists but join the political mainstream the same time, that is an absolute red line too. Or if they want deny the rights for men and women, then that wont be allowed. But there will be no pre-conditions for talks with the Taliban.
What is the Indian position on all of this? Last year when the MoU between the NDS (Afghan intelligence) and ISI was signed, and when you announced talks with the Taliban in Pakistan, and China attending, India was caught off guard.
Dr. Abdullah: That’s how you see it from the outside. Within, India is kept in the loop throughout, because India has a stake in the stabilization of the country and India has helped with stabilizing Afghanistan. India has not tried to impose anything on us. Our relations are friendly and open, we can discuss anything.
Are you saying India has not objected to the MoU or the talks with the Taliban?
Dr. Abdullah: India understands our situation, and the level of understanding on each others position is complete. Afghanistan is not in anyone’s pocket. Remember, Afghanistan is important for India, but India is also a global player, and Afghanistan’s relations with other countries has not affected our bilateral relations at all. There is a fundamental agreement that the process must be Afghan owned and Afghan led, the rest of it is how to do it.
How is it Afghan owned and Afghan led if the talks are held in Pakistan, attended by ISI and Pakistani officials, with the Taliban brought to the table and chosen by Pakistan?
Dr. Abdullah: First you must differentiate between talks with the Taliban and talks with the Quadrilateral group. It doesn’t matter where it takes place. Yes, there is a symbolism attached to the venue, and yes we do ask the countries to use their influence to facilitate the talks with the Taliban. But the decision on the way forward will be made by the Afghan. Certain countries have certain influences, so what’s wrong if use those.
15 years ago you had come to India with a mission to warn the world about the Taliban pre-9/11. How worried are you about the return of Taliban rule or as part of a power-sharing arrangement?
The Taliban had hoped to return militarily in 2014-15. While there is no doubt they have exacted major casualties on our security forces and civilians, they have not managed to do that. Peace is the desire of our people, and the efforts that we are taking towards reconciliation are in line with that.
If not the Taliban, then could it be ISIS that could take over Afghanistan?
ISIS is also a threat, and we will keep our focus on fighting it.
